本文转自2022年11月3日CGTN公众号。

Editor's note: Former Deputy Prime Minister of Poland Grzegorz W. Kolodko sits down with CGTN anchor Xu Qinduo. He says that we have to find a pragmatic and peaceful way to work arm-in-arm with China to solve global problems. Extreme poverty has been completely erased in China, which is the extremely great success of Chinese economic policy, and one has to take it into account. Views expressed in the video are his and do not necessarily represent those of CGTN.

编者按: 波兰前副总理格热戈日·科沃德科在接受CGTN主持人许钦铎采访时表示，美英需要探索务实和平的方式与中国携手合作，解决全球问题。在中国，绝对贫困已被完全消除。这是中国经济政策取得的巨大成功。本视频仅代表被访者个人观点，不代表CGTN的观点或立场。

Mr. Kolodko: China, 30 years ago in China, now it's a very different country. I'm saying that one has to compare China, Chinese system, both a complex system, political and economic one, because it is just a complex, political, economic system with Russia, on the one hand, and with India.

格热戈日·科沃德科：相比于三十年前，现在的中国已经今非昔比。中国的制度是一个复杂的整体，既有政治层面，也有经济层面。观察中国需要（同其他国家）对比，比如俄罗斯，以及印度。

Mr. Kolodko: Thirty-one years ago, in 1991, the GDP per capita in India was slightly higher than in China. In both countries, there were hundreds of millions of people living in extreme poverty. Now, in India, we have more than 100 million people living in extreme poverty, according to the World Bank definition, no more less than $1.9 per day on purchasing power parity, and it has been erased completely in China. This is the extremely great success of Chinese economic policy, and one has to take it into account.

格热戈日·科沃德科：31年前，也就是1991年，印度的人均GDP略高于中国。当时，这两个国家都有数亿人生活在极端贫困中。现在，根据世界银行的标准，印度仍有1亿多人生活在极端贫困中，按购买力平价计算，每人每天生活支出低于1.9美元，而在中国，绝对贫困已被完全消除。这是中国经济政策取得的巨大成功，这一点我们必须要承认。

Mr. Kolodko: So the question is: if China had chosen through two generations and three decades ago, a different political path, how would be now the social and economic situation in China? I think it would be much worse, much more similar, say, to India. And that may make some countries envy. They don't understand that we have to find the way – I mean "they" in Washington or London – that we have to find a pragmatic, peaceful way to work arm-in-arm with China, how to solve the global problems, and how to take advantage of this stage of technological economic development for the benefit of our societies through the peaceful cooperation, not hostility.

格热戈日·科沃德科：试想，如果中国在过去两代人，过去三十年里，选择另一条政治道路，那么现在中国社会和经济状况会是什么样呢？我认为会比现在差得远，可能会类似印度的情况。（中国的发展）引发一些国家的嫉妒，比如美国和英国，他们不理解，我们需要找到一种务实、和平的方式，与中国携手合作，探索如何利用当今的技术经济发展，通过和平合作而不是对抗，来造福社会。

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