Transcript:

BBC presenter Kirsty Wark: First I'm joined by Professor Wang Wen, Executive Dean of Chongyang Institute for Financial Studies and the author of Great Powers, Long March Road, the Views of China's Rejuvenation and the Future of the World after a Hundred Countries Visit. Good evening to you, Wang Wen. First of all, we just heard Putin’s invasion of Ukraine has put China in a very difficult position. So strategically, is there a rule for China in Ukraine? What are the considerations?

Wang Wen：Actually, I think all Chinese believe that this is a tragedy. Chinese never thought that this crisis would happen. Chinese people hope to end the crisis as soon as possible. Secondly, most Chinese believe that the crisis is very complex and cannot be described as a simple "invasion". We sympathize with Ukraine. Ukraine is very pity. It is obviously cheated by the United States and NATO. Ukraine has become the war agent of the United States to suppress Russia and is the biggest loser of this crisis. That’s why we are concerned about the Ukrainian people, and China has provided humanitarian assistance. In China's view, Ukraine's best strategic positioning is to become a bridge for the exchange of civilizations between the East and the West.

BBC presenter Kirsty Wark: Let's be clear, you believe that the US and NATO are agents of the war in Ukraine. China so far has remained neutral, but is he in the business of propping up Vladimir Putin? When presumably China thinks the way that the invasion of Ukraine has been handled whether you agree or not, has been catastrophic.

Wang Wen: I think now we should focus on the US. Actually, we have to know the United States is acting too hypocritical. If Ukraine is a beauty, then the United States is a scum man, the US urged the beautiful girl to break up with Russia, encouraged her to fight with Russia and promised protection. As a result, Ukraine was beaten and many Ukrainian people died. I often say that peace should first keep the US away. The US is the biggest troublemaker of the wars. As long as the US resolves any differences, most of them will become crises and disasters.

BBC presenter Kirsty Wark: So, that is your views what happening in Ukraine. Then, let’s talk a little bit about Taiwan. Because as we said earlier in program tonight, in 2019, China made a speech. When he said, the future of Taiwan and the resolution of Taiwan is not something that will be left to the next generation. Should China claim Taiwan and he did not rule this out if necessary by force.

Wang Wen: I think you cannot compare the Ukraine issues with Taiwan issues. Because Taiwan is a part of the China, you cannot just very simply compare. Firstly, Taiwan is part of China. But now because of some historical reasons, we didn’t reunify. But all the people in China we believe that the reunite is necessary and inevitable. So, I think these are two very different things. But…

BBC presenter Kirsty Wark: Wang Wen, if I can just ask you about that we know the twenty-three million people in Taiwan don't necessarily want anything other than the situation they have now. President Biden said that if Taiwan was co-opted that was against its will, he would come to Taiwan’s aid. Do you think that’s a legitimate position for Joe Biden to give Taiwan wants to remain independent from China?

Wang Wen: I think one obvious condition is that over the past half century, the US has often provoked wars between neighboring countries or neighboring regions in other regions, such as Iran and Iraq, India and Pakistan, now is Ukraine and Russia, so as to maintain its hegemony. We are afraid that next time it’s Taiwan Strait the US will provoke another war. As I said right now, just make America away with any differences. So, I think Taiwan issues belong to China ourselves to solve it. This time, all people can see through the hypocrisy of American values and the end of American credibility. So, just don’t make the compare.

BBC presenter Kirsty Wark: Thank you very much.